New York Avenue D.C. Plans Include Tunnel, Bridge, Path

[Douglas A. Willinger]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A6877-2004Jan10.html
"A Push to Improve New York Avenue -
D.C. Plans Include Tunnel, Bridge, Path"
_Washington Post_ - Sunday, January 11, 2004
'The heavily traveled road, bordered by light-industrial and commercial
properties as well as brick rowhouses and the National Arboretum, is one
of the busiest access routes to Washington. An estimated 126,000
vehicles a day enter New York Avenue at the Maryland line, many of them
using it to reach Interstate 395, Rybeck said. "People are using New
York Avenue as a highway," Rybeck said. "They're cutting through the
District going from somewhere else to somewhere else."'

OH NO!!!!! Heaven forbid we should need to get from one side of the
district to the other!! Last night I used this exact route to get
back to VA from NY....I came in over the Bay Bridge and US 50 and
needed to get to I-66...so I took US 50 and NY Ave, I-395, VA 110, and
I-66. I figured the Beltway north of the city is a crapshoot in terms
of traffic, and the Beltway south of the city is virtually guaranteed
to be jammed at Springfield and/or the Wilson Bridge. Either Beltway
route involves going far out of my way when I can just take the
strtaightest route. My fears were confirmed when I crossed the
Beltway at US 50.....bumper to bumper heading north. So of course
people are "using it like a highway". Plus I bet most of those people
are coming from the NE to Washington. Remember, this is zero freeway
access to the District from all of MD in between GW PArkway and
I-295....zero....so yes, people are going to use the arterials.

I heard this same lack of committment as being part of a region, at
the January 10, 2004 meeting which I attended. Various concerns that
I brought up -- such as the deficent geometry of the transition of the
one tunnel route they are studying wrapping around the rear side of
the Bibleway Church complex, and the stingy capacity of a mere 2 lanes
per direction, especially with a new South Capital Street Tunnel
connecting at its southern end -- were met with the official attitude
that the project should benifit fewer people, because they were not
District residents.

Of course this was accompanied by a notation that the project must be
funded by those who are not District residents.

Douglas A. Willinger
Takoma Park Highway Design Studio
http://www.HighwaysAndCommunities.com

[Mike Tantillo]

Post by Douglas A. Willinger

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A6877-2004Jan10.html
"A Push to Improve New York Avenue -
D.C. Plans Include Tunnel, Bridge, Path"
_Washington Post_ - Sunday, January 11, 2004
'The heavily traveled road, bordered by light-industrial and commercial
properties as well as brick rowhouses and the National Arboretum, is one
of the busiest access routes to Washington. An estimated 126,000
vehicles a day enter New York Avenue at the Maryland line, many of them
using it to reach Interstate 395, Rybeck said. "People are using New
York Avenue as a highway," Rybeck said. "They're cutting through the
District going from somewhere else to somewhere else."'

OH NO!!!!! Heaven forbid we should need to get from one side of the
district to the other!! Last night I used this exact route to get
back to VA from NY....I came in over the Bay Bridge and US 50 and
needed to get to I-66...so I took US 50 and NY Ave, I-395, VA 110, and
I-66. I figured the Beltway north of the city is a crapshoot in terms
of traffic, and the Beltway south of the city is virtually guaranteed
to be jammed at Springfield and/or the Wilson Bridge. Either Beltway
route involves going far out of my way when I can just take the
strtaightest route. My fears were confirmed when I crossed the
Beltway at US 50.....bumper to bumper heading north. So of course
people are "using it like a highway". Plus I bet most of those people
are coming from the NE to Washington. Remember, this is zero freeway
access to the District from all of MD in between GW PArkway and
I-295....zero....so yes, people are going to use the arterials.

I heard this same lack of committment as being part of a region, at
the January 10, 2004 meeting which I attended. Various concerns that
I brought up -- such as the deficent geometry of the transition of the
one tunnel route they are studying wrapping around the rear side of
the Bibleway Church complex, and the stingy capacity of a mere 2 lanes
per direction, especially with a new South Capital Street Tunnel
connecting at its southern end -- were met with the official attitude
that the project should benifit fewer people, because they were not
District residents.
Of course this was accompanied by a notation that the project must be
funded by those who are not District residents.

Which side of a political line someone lives on should not make any
difference...it is part of the Washington, DC Metropolitan area.

Furthermore, unlike every other city in the country where they cater
to their residents only, since it is "their" city and not my
city....Washington has the unique distinction of being "everyone's"
city....every American's that is. I should have just as much say in
Washington politics as someone who lives there...thats what the
planners in the late 1700's thought anyway when they made the decision
to make the nation's capital city in a district of its own instead of
in one of the states. The point of that was that all Americans were
to have a say in DC politics, as the city was to be ruled by Congress.
It was only recently that the city got a city govt., and thus far,
i'm not too impressed with what i've seen come out of the DC city govt
(one only needs to look at the fact that they elected a convict as
mayor) since its inception. Congress has the authority to abolish the
DC city govt today if they really wanted to, and while I am certainly
not recommending that they do this (the city govt takes care of the
nitty gritty that the average american doesn't care about, like DC
garbage collection and street cleaning), I wish Congress would step in
more often and use their de-facto veto-power to say "look, every
American has the right to decent access to DC".


Sorry, i'm in a rather anti-DC mood today after being nailed by their
portable photo-radar cars....on New York Avenue ironically.

In the end I hope federal highway administration gets involved and
rejects the design due to its dangerous geometry (FHWA would have
jurisdiction over what amounts to an on-ramp to the interstate system
I assume) and forces people to go back and reevaluate the design.
With modern day tunneling techniques, i'm sure they could find a way
to tunnel under the structures without tearing them down.

Post by Douglas A. Willinger
Douglas A. Willinger
Takoma Park Highway Design Studio
http://www.HighwaysAndCommunities.com

[Douglas A. Willinger]

Post by Mike Tantillo
In the end I hope federal highway administration gets involved and
rejects the design due to its dangerous geometry (FHWA would have
jurisdiction over what amounts to an on-ramp to the interstate system
I assume) and forces people to go back and reevaluate the design.
With modern day tunneling techniques, i'm sure they could find a way
to tunnel under the structures without tearing them down.

Maybe. Perhaps by freezing the soil?

Of course, given the added economy of drilling tunnels over greater
distances, a mere 500-700 foot long segment to save about 34 houses
between 4th Street and 3rd Strete/New Jersey Avenue, New York Avenue
and N Street, may result in higher costs per residences saved.

It may be more economically sensible to remove and ultimately
replicate these buildings in the same archetectual style, with money
left over to provide more generous compensation for the residents.

Any comprehensive study on I-395 and New York Avenue is going to have
to include a look at these different options, plus other factors such
as filtration systems, and not meerly limit itself to the one basic
option which provides highly questionable geometry for a project with
a long life expectancy.

Douglas A. Willinger
Takoma Park Highway Design Studio
http://www.HighwaysAndCommunities.com

[Mike Tantillo]

Post by Douglas A. Willinger

Post by Mike Tantillo
In the end I hope federal highway administration gets involved and
rejects the design due to its dangerous geometry (FHWA would have
jurisdiction over what amounts to an on-ramp to the interstate system
I assume) and forces people to go back and reevaluate the design.
With modern day tunneling techniques, i'm sure they could find a way
to tunnel under the structures without tearing them down.

Maybe. Perhaps by freezing the soil?

Thay are doing this is NY with the 3rd water tunnel...not sure exactly
how, but they are....

I'd imagine the tunnel would need to be deep.

Post by Douglas A. Willinger
Of course, given the added economy of drilling tunnels over greater
distances, a mere 500-700 foot long segment to save about 34 houses
between 4th Street and 3rd Strete/New Jersey Avenue, New York Avenue
and N Street, may result in higher costs per residences saved.
It may be more economically sensible to remove and ultimately
replicate these buildings in the same archetectual style, with money
left over to provide more generous compensation for the residents.
Any comprehensive study on I-395 and New York Avenue is going to have
to include a look at these different options, plus other factors such
as filtration systems, and not meerly limit itself to the one basic
option which provides highly questionable geometry for a project with
a long life expectancy.

Perhaps the houses can be relocated, as is, to another block nearby?
There are plenty of empty "brownfields" in the area that could support
relocated houses IIRC. But then again, this is DC, home of "no white
man's roads through black man's homes".......BTW, the part of MD near
where NY Ave enters the state is predominantly minority as well IIRC,
so actually that argument holds no merit.

Post by Douglas A. Willinger
Douglas A. Willinger
Takoma Park Highway Design Studio
http://www.HighwaysAndCommunities.com